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PD Moderator	Message Posted: Apr 3, 2012 2:20:03 PM Ignore PD Report Abuse The EPA is getting ever closer to approving E15 for use in 2001 and newer vehicles. In the last few days, several lobby groups have convinced politicians to make sure that gasoline stations don't have liability and are somewhat immune from responsibility over their customers improperly filling their vehicles. What's that mean? If you accidentally fill up with E15 in your older vehicle because the sign is too small or you aren't keen enough to see what you're pumping, you can't hold the gas stations liable for that small sign or warning. It's another sign that the renewable fuel industry continues to lobby on their own behalf instead of doing what motorists desire, which according to recent GasBuddy polls, is doing anything... Visit GasBuddy Blog for full article

Moderator

Message Posted: Apr 3, 2012 2:20:03 PM

Ignore PD Report Abuse

The EPA is getting ever closer to approving E15 for use in 2001 and newer vehicles. In the last few days, several lobby groups have convinced politicians to make sure that gasoline stations don't have liability and are somewhat immune from responsibility over their customers improperly filling their vehicles.

What's that mean? If you accidentally fill up with E15 in your older vehicle because the sign is too small or you aren't keen enough to see what you're pumping, you can't hold the gas stations liable for that small sign or warning.

It's another sign that the renewable fuel industry continues to lobby on their own behalf instead of doing what motorists desire, which according to recent GasBuddy polls, is doing anything...

Visit GasBuddy Blog for full article

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Vette1967 Champion Author Albany Posts:5,962 Points:1,275,025 Joined:Jun 2009	Message Posted: Apr 22, 2012 1:20:48 AM Ignore Vette1967 Report Abuse ok
gas4433 Champion Author Houston Posts:2,352 Points:544,775 Joined:Sep 2011	Message Posted: Apr 20, 2012 4:25:09 PM Ignore gas4433 Report Abuse no
JediKnight Champion Author Wisconsin Posts:4,848 Points:2,033,560 Joined:May 2004	Message Posted: Apr 20, 2012 4:22:23 PM Ignore JediKnight Report Abuse honda0105, Off of what PaylessKY said. How about letting those E85 Pumps offer additional Blends from E0-E85? Most Stations I've seen with E85 keep them away from the "Regular" Pumps. (Unless it's like an "unmanned" Renew Fuel Station which in WI currently offers E10/E20/E85.) It's not unheard of to see Stations that have "Blender" Pumps so you could pump E10/E20/E30/E85 from one location your choice. If you MUST have nothing over E10... and risk "contamination" Then you can park over by the "non-Blender" Pump(s) and play it "safe". My Non-FFV works fine up to around E48 before it throws a Lean Code. But it even then it runs fine. (I do avoid further "risk" by just adding more Gasoline so the Light goes out and it's Air/Fuel Trim is within the Car Computer's limits. Usually I shoot for E20/E30 as it's not often "full strength" I "water it down" with a partial tank of E10... So E15/E20.) Oil Analysis tests are within my Engine's Average and Universal Ranges. It has just recently hit 100,000 Miles and 9 years on the road and still going strong. Which probably means it's time for another Oil Test see how it compares to my First Oil Sample taken around 3,000 miles.
PaylessKY Champion Author Kentucky Posts:8,715 Points:1,581,350 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Apr 10, 2012 11:14:54 PM Ignore PaylessKY Report Abuse I hope if any station I go to sells E15, they keep away from the regular pumps.
albert2008 Champion Author Winnipeg Posts:7,347 Points:1,480,035 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Apr 8, 2012 9:06:06 AM Ignore albert2008 Report Abuse i dont blame them
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,610 Points:1,608,545 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Apr 8, 2012 8:20:19 AM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse calypso: I'm with you. I hope I don't see E15 at all stations here b/c I like driving my cars for 12-15 years.
calypso93 Champion Author Scranton Posts:11,203 Points:1,292,385 Joined:Mar 2004	Message Posted: Apr 7, 2012 9:05:15 PM Ignore calypso93 Report Abuse Yup, wave the magic wand and E-15 is magically OK for my car.
albert2008 Champion Author Winnipeg Posts:7,347 Points:1,480,035 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Apr 7, 2012 9:13:58 AM Ignore albert2008 Report Abuse i dont blame them
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,610 Points:1,608,545 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Apr 7, 2012 7:49:16 AM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse Caprice: and it takes 8 gallon of fossil fuel to make 10 gallons of EtOH which has a 20% reduced heat capacity. That's what makes EtOH from corn so bad. I don't think that mpg / lower emissions are pulling in opposite directions, but it takes more than just adding EtOH to achieve both.
CapriceWagon All-Star Author Washington Posts:934 Points:478,095 Joined:Feb 2008	Message Posted: Apr 6, 2012 12:51:55 PM Ignore CapriceWagon Report Abuse Ethanol is being pushed on us because it's cleaner burning and thus lower emission than petroleum gasoline. It's part of the EPA's double standard: they require vehicle manufacturers to meet certain MPG standards, but also meet certain tailpipe emissions. We've come to the point in technology where these two standards are pulling on opposite ends of the same rope, either we get lower emissions OR we get better MPG. The same is the case with new diesel vehicles with urea injection in the exhaust, they burn extra fuel to clean out the exhaust. Personally, I'd rather get better fuel economy out of my diesel and put a little soot in the atmosphere on startup than waste more fossil fuel to prevent the soot. There's only so much energy in a given unit of fuel, what the EPA is asking defies that logic.
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,610 Points:1,608,545 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Apr 6, 2012 6:00:10 AM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse EtOH from corn has never been the answer.
Reishman Veteran Author Illinois Posts:384 Points:515,865 Joined:Sep 2006	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2012 10:24:48 PM Ignore Reishman Report Abuse I don't trsut E15.
sparky808 Champion Author Honolulu Posts:2,998 Points:597,735 Joined:Sep 2011	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2012 1:21:21 PM Ignore sparky808 Report Abuse End the ethanol mandate.
Hunter114 Champion Author Chicago Posts:9,081 Points:1,448,760 Joined:Apr 2009	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2012 9:05:15 AM Ignore Hunter114 Report Abuse Agree with Cheepo.
albert2008 Champion Author Winnipeg Posts:7,347 Points:1,480,035 Joined:Sep 2008	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2012 8:38:40 AM Ignore albert2008 Report Abuse i would to
FBI2991 Champion Author Michigan Posts:4,205 Points:1,138,890 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2012 8:27:37 AM Ignore FBI2991 Report Abuse Get rid of ethanol
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,610 Points:1,608,545 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2012 6:08:58 AM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse let's have E85 pumps and keep the rest EtOH free.
honda0105 Champion Author Tallahassee Posts:18,610 Points:1,608,545 Joined:Nov 2008	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2012 6:08:00 AM Ignore honda0105 Report Abuse tico: that is, if you can find EtOH-free fuel.
snappytom2 Champion Author Corpus Christi Posts:3,546 Points:274,545 Joined:Jul 2008	Message Posted: Apr 5, 2012 1:05:30 AM Ignore snappytom2 Report Abuse Ethanol belongs is Wild Turkey, not my gas tank.
Reishman Veteran Author Illinois Posts:384 Points:515,865 Joined:Sep 2006	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 11:59:56 PM Ignore Reishman Report Abuse E15 is a scam.
gknee09 All-Star Author Philadelphia Posts:980 Points:821,915 Joined:Jul 2009	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 11:41:26 PM Ignore gknee09 Report Abuse just make the sign bigger!
my2002m Champion Author Tulsa Posts:6,069 Points:1,669,325 Joined:Jul 2008	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 10:54:01 PM Ignore my2002m Report Abuse Hope they get it because I don't want to buy it.
Ticobird Champion Author Huntsville Posts:3,226 Points:1,115,040 Joined:Oct 2009	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 8:45:17 PM Ignore Ticobird Report Abuse If a gasoline customer was given a choice to fill their vehicle gas tank every 6 days rather than every 7 days they would understand the choice better and most likely choose the no ethanol option. E15 is crazy. I won't buy it.
Cheepo Champion Author Tampa Posts:9,889 Points:3,128,005 Joined:Apr 2003	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 7:02:08 PM Ignore Cheepo Report Abuse Dump the epa and ethanol!!!!!!!
confetti Veteran Author Tampa Posts:354 Points:362,290 Joined:Jan 2006	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 5:51:36 PM Ignore confetti Report Abuse Interesting comments by many. I agree that personal responsibility plays a big role in people not damaging their cars (or themselves), but offering a type of gas that can harm many cars does seem to require an effort to adequately advise consumers what they're getting. I'm not sure exactly what the law says, but it does not seem fair if stations can post ineffective notice in tiny print and not be liable for damages.
h2ojumper Champion Author Austin Posts:2,555 Points:706,660 Joined:Feb 2011	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 4:58:05 PM Ignore h2ojumper Report Abuse ok
indyjim Champion Author Indianapolis Posts:10,088 Points:2,318,455 Joined:Jul 2006	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 4:53:31 PM Ignore indyjim Report Abuse If the govt. keeps up this forcing of ethanol on the public, I wouldn't be surprised to see people cutting the pump lines to keep ethanol from being pumped.
zaq001 Champion Author Atlanta Posts:3,975 Points:1,472,100 Joined:Oct 2008	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 4:24:17 PM Ignore zaq001 Report Abuse ok...not a bad idea
URKiddinMee Champion Author South Carolina Posts:1,214 Points:242,910 Joined:May 2008	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 4:23:07 PM Ignore URKiddinMee Report Abuse ETHANOL! The auto mechanic's friend.
azadus All-Star Author Houston Posts:554 Points:110,975 Joined:Mar 2012	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 3:58:58 PM Ignore azadus Report Abuse ok
mnorthwood13 Champion Author Michigan Posts:1,385 Points:762,885 Joined:Apr 2010	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 2:28:27 PM Ignore mnorthwood13 Report Abuse Please stop E15. Gas mileage is so helpful...
melvindale Champion Author Michigan Posts:1,438 Points:351,230 Joined:Jun 2011	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 2:13:41 PM Ignore melvindale Report Abuse Why not a standard warning sign large enough for anybody to read, placed prominently (in a specified location ON the pump)??? Then the law can give the gas stations a pass against lawsuits IF (and only IF) they obeyed and had the warning posted. Its reasonable, if a rollout to the public was made.
GatorGuy Champion Author Columbia Posts:2,228 Points:1,206,495 Joined:Jan 2009	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 2:09:22 PM Ignore GatorGuy Report Abuse So where do I get gas for my '97 Jeep? Keep corn out of our tanks, I rely on my engine!
jjw0608 Champion Author Milwaukee Posts:6,869 Points:1,700,055 Joined:Nov 2005	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 2:06:35 PM Ignore jjw0608 Report Abuse Good for them!
montytexas Champion Author Houston Posts:2,899 Points:1,410,515 Joined:Jun 2006	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 2:06:31 PM Ignore montytexas Report Abuse No more "corn liquor" please !!!
bluetatanka Champion Author Philadelphia Posts:55,901 Points:780,855 Joined:Mar 2011	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 2:02:48 PM Ignore bluetatanka Report Abuse Who has the answer to the BIG question of WHY is any ethanol, E10, E15, etc. being pushed onto us?
vizilo Champion Author British Columbia Posts:5,729 Points:2,590,650 Joined:May 2004	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 2:01:38 PM Ignore vizilo Report Abuse No point to it
rbrowdersr Champion Author Detroit Posts:5,719 Points:1,818,820 Joined:Aug 2006	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 2:00:56 PM Ignore rbrowdersr Report Abuse I doubt they will be successful.
OnEmptyMO Champion Author St. Louis Posts:4,986 Points:1,487,640 Joined:Mar 2008	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 2:00:33 PM Ignore OnEmptyMO Report Abuse Quit messing with the food chain!!!!
SUPERQUACK Champion Author Sacramento Posts:6,121 Points:1,910,855 Joined:Jun 2007	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:59:41 PM Ignore SUPERQUACK Report Abuse GO FOR IT ... LET THE POLITICOS "EAT IT "
eye-spy Champion Author Quebec Posts:4,583 Points:2,416,870 Joined:Feb 2005	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:55:09 PM Ignore eye-spy Report Abuse Right On!!!....JasonKY
JagXKR Champion Author British Columbia Posts:3,154 Points:1,090,555 Joined:Dec 2009	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:53:46 PM Ignore JagXKR Report Abuse No food in my tank, ever!
JasonKY Veteran Author Lexington Posts:292 Points:67,795 Joined:Feb 2012	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:47:08 PM Ignore JasonKY Report Abuse Something has to be done. I don't know what that will look like, but there is going to be those individuals who don't look before they pump. It is funny how many times the Fed has to step in to prevent some consumers from hurting themselves and then turning around and blaming someone for their mistake. It sounds like a recipe for another McDonald and "hot coffee" fiasco.
deputydog082 Champion Author Detroit Posts:1,781 Points:659,365 Joined:Apr 2011	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:44:51 PM Ignore deputydog082 Report Abuse E15 = worse gas mileage
Busymomma56 Sophomore Author Utah Posts:224 Points:52,120 Joined:Mar 2012	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:44:31 PM Ignore Busymomma56 Report Abuse What happened to customer service? Is it a BIG deal to make a sign a bit larger...the gas companies are making record profits, I'm sue they can afford a bit bigger sign without making a law of it.
WillyG Champion Author Cincinnati Posts:3,548 Points:905,115 Joined:Aug 2005	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:42:18 PM Ignore WillyG Report Abuse What they need to do is make sure that if you push the button to select E15 gas that there's a couple questions either on the screen or audible that asks you if you're sure that's what you want. Are you sure ? followed by : "Are you absolutely sure" ? I like the different nozzle sizes they have from unleaded gas to diesel, but it's too costly to change gas tank spout opening, pump size, and so forth. So I think the cheaper alternative is to include those couple warnings/questions.
97beater Sophomore Author Madison Posts:249 Points:290,605 Joined:May 2011	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:38:32 PM Ignore 97beater Report Abuse great I have a 97, no E15 for me.
MrSquash Rookie Author California Posts:2 Points:2,015 Joined:Apr 2012	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:37:53 PM Ignore MrSquash Report Abuse oi.
357revo Champion Author Pittsburgh Posts:18,118 Points:2,383,630 Joined:Sep 2006	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:36:09 PM Ignore 357revo Report Abuse Dump E15 AND THE EPA that is pushing it down our throats!
GaSrt8 Veteran Author Georgia Posts:331 Points:398,930 Joined:Nov 2011	Message Posted: Apr 4, 2012 1:34:09 PM Ignore GaSrt8 Report Abuse We dont need yet another grade of gas. My 2012 Prius V states on the gas cap not to use any gasoline that is higher than 10% ethanol period.